My entire career in corporate was always working with really, really good companies until I didn't. And I would say that the majority of the employers I worked for, worked with, were good stewards of their employee welfare and employee engagement. So I'd be very curious about your perspective on that.

Ben Gardier

I would say the majority probably are. However, there's a lot, and it's a meaningful number that I've observed, who are not. They don't treat their employees the best. They abuse their employees. They are careless with their customers. For example, if a customer has an issue, they are only focused on the transaction at the moment and not looking to the long-term relationship. Essentially being unwilling to maybe not make a profit or take a loss on the immediate transaction and ignoring all the future profits that can accrue from just having a long-term relationship and doing right by a customer and things like that, doing right by employees. And I think the fact that so many business owners kind of take their employees and their customers for granted, it's very short-sighted. And being a business owner who is the complete opposite of that, I've seen that yield dividends in terms of employee loyalty, taking customers from a lot of our competitors. And I just think it's pretty incredible, the outcome from those types of interactions.

Maureen Farmer

I agree wholeheartedly. And I have done a lot of research, Ben, myself on recognition and the power of recognition. I know for a fact, just given my experience, and I have training in human resources management as well as professional development. And what I've learned is, and this won't be any surprise to anyone listening to this call or to you either, I'm sure Ben, is that employees at every level, from the mailroom to the boardroom, are motivated by sincere recognition, not typically the paycheck. Now, we all need to live and we all are motivated to take care of our families and do those types of things. That's natural, but organizations and business leaders that take the time to offer sincere and authentic appreciation for a job well done, the employee will go the extra mile and it extends from the employee straight through to the customer and I agree with that wholeheartedly and I don't understand why organizations don't look at that. I also don't understand why organizations tolerate a poor leadership when we have so many KPIs that we measure turnover and retention and all of these different KPIs. why organizational leaders won't address some of these issues when they know full well that these issues are happening, And it's to their own detriment. It's to the detriment of their employees, the detriment to their stakeholders and the entire ecosystem. So I agree with you.

Ben Gardier

Yes. And especially in our business where we have a number of... Our employees, they're low wage employees. They're working in a laundromat, they're working in a commercial laundry facility. And they can go anywhere and get a job that pays them the same or more. So in our situation, especially, you can't have an employee come to work who hates their job, and they're also not getting paid the best. So our focus is on making sure that they come to work, they love the place they work at, and that they don't have to have the additional burden of dealing with a manager or a work environment that isn't comfortable for them. And because of that, we've been able to etain employees for quite a long time. It's typically a situation where it might be high turnover until we find the right person. And when we find the right person, they stay with us for a very long time. And they come from some of those competitors that I mentioned that really don't treat their employees the best. So it's just a surprise to kind of see that being prevalent across all industries.

Maureen Farmer

Yes. It's a really good observation, Ben. And I really appreciate your sharing that because it is very, very important to me. I have a couple of infographics I'll send over to you, and you feel free to adapt them as you wish. It does demonstrate that a high- workforce is far more successful in the longterm. There's a company in actually Sunnyvale, California called Trimble. And Trimble is an industrial technology company and they were founded in, I think the 70s or the 80s. I can't recall, but they've only ever had three CEOs in the organization. And the two former CEOs are now on the board. They have really high employee engagement. And if you go to their website, they have these videos that talk about their customers. This company is the original developer of the GPS and a really, really interesting company. And the original CEO and founder is still on the board. Just a really interesting case study, given technology and how it changes and given all of the economic downturns, the global financial crisis and COVID and all of these other types of challenges, the company has been able to maintain its position, I think, ahead of their competition. I'm pretty sure. So... ahead of their competition. I'm pretty sure. 

Ben Gardier

Yeah, that's a pretty interesting observation.

Maureen Farmer

All right, Ben. Well, I guess that's a wrap. It's been a pleasure speaking with you and I'll be following you.

Ben Gardier

Thank you for having me on your podcast, Maureen.